Meeting Summary - 05/08/2025 Senate Business & Commerce

▶️2 - HB14 Harris | et al. SP: Schwertner

• The chair introduced HB14 and recognized Senator Schwertner to explain the bill.
• Previous testimony from nuclear experts on SB2967 was mentioned as foundational for advancing nuclear power.
• The committee is encouraged to consider the role of nuclear energy in Texas and legislative directions for the session.
• HB14 proposes the establishment of the Texas Advanced Nuclear Energy Office under the governor's direction.
• A Texas Advanced Nuclear Development Fund will be created to support nuclear development via reimbursement based grants.
• A completion grant program is proposed for advanced nuclear projects connected to ERCOT.
• An advanced nuclear energy workforce development program will be administered by multiple state entities.
• The bill is open for consideration and public testimony was invited.
• Public testimonies were limited to two minutes per individual.

▶️2.1 - Griffin Perry, Fermi America

• Griffin Perry represents Fermi America and supports HB14, emphasizing the need for more base load power in Texas.
• He advocates for nuclear power as safe, reliable, and dispatchable, highlighting that the U.S. has been using it for over eighty years.
• Recent technological advances have made nuclear power safer and available in smaller reactors.
• Perry urges Texas to lead in nuclear energy, following the steps of other proactive states.
• The Fermi America project commenced approximately 120 days ago and has received significant federal government support.
• Challenges in nuclear projects often involve being over budget and delayed; however, modular nuclear power can mitigate these issues by being quicker and safer.
• While advocating for nuclear energy, Perry acknowledges the state's strong natural gas resources and supports continuing natural gas generation.
• Expresses gratitude to Chairman Schwertner and the committee for the platform to present his views.

▶️Billy Bardin, Dow Chemical

• Billy Bardin from Dow Chemical expressed support for HB14.
• Dow Chemical is partnering with X Energy to develop four 80-megawatt gas-cooled modular reactors, totaling 320 megawatts, at their site in Seadrift, Texas.
• The project is progressing through the federal process with the Nuclear Regulatory Commission.
• Bardin emphasized the importance of a state program for supporting first-of-a-kind deployments in advanced nuclear reactors to generate reliable, zero-emission electricity.
• He highlighted the significance of creating oversight authority to signal market seriousness and promote the industry's growth in Texas.
• Bardin stressed the need for partnerships between private companies and all government levels to ensure a successful project roadmap.
• The importance of a demand pool in creating a complete supply chain and reducing costs was noted, along with benefits to economies at local, state, and federal levels.
• Bardin discussed the protection of state funds through rigorous project evaluation processes and milestone-based investment decisions.
• He concluded by expressing appreciation for the committee's work and offered to answer any questions.

▶️Adrian Shelley, Public Citizen

• Adrian Shelley spoke in opposition to HB14, focusing on concerns regarding nuclear power projects.
• Belief that nuclear power projects will not come online soon and will be very expensive.
• Grants are being provided instead of loans, with most available before actual electricity generation.
• Suggestion to convert the grant program into a loan program with specific benchmarks.
• SMRs (Small Modular Reactors) in the US have not generated electricity and face budget and time overruns.
• The Vogtle reactor in Georgia had significant delays and budget overruns, becoming the most expensive power in the US.
• Proposed series of amendments include converting the program to loans, emphasizing workforce development, grant award criteria, life cycle management, and safety.
• Concerns about the lack of a solution for nuclear waste and the challenges with recycling high-level waste.

▶️Craig Nazor, Sierra Club

• Craig Nazor, representing the Sierra Club, opposed HB14.
• Nazor emphasized the natural efficiency of solar energy found in nature, as opposed to nuclear energy.
• He highlighted the issue of nuclear energy producing excessive waste, which is problematic on Earth’s closed system.
• Nazor mentioned the expense associated with nuclear energy, citing waste management as a significant cost factor.
• He questioned why grants would be provided for an expensive energy production method like nuclear energy.
• Nazor suggested a more extended discussion on the topic was needed, but time constraints prevented it.

▶️Senator Schwertner to Panel 1 Group

• Senator Schwertner asks Griffin Perry about the benefit of Texas establishing an office to aid with permitting and incentives, and project time frames.
• Perry states that Texans will gain reliable base load power.
• Where Texas is in terms of technology compared to the Vogtle project is much quicker; the delay exists in the global supply chain.
• The timeline for obtaining a permit has traditionally been close to a decade. 
• Fermi has completed the environmental work surrounding its site and based on conversations with the head of the NRC expects approximately 12-18 months to obtain a permit.
• Schwertner asks Billy Bardin about Dow’s project and their timeline.
• The project was announced in 2023 in partnership with X Energy.
• The project is expected to be brought on in the early 2030’s, providing behind the meter power.
• Discussion on whether Texas should subsidize projects that provide behind the meter generation.
• Benefit to Texas: Creates skilled workforce, job opportunities, viability of site infrastructure.
• Concerns: Subsidizing behind meter generation does not supply to grid directly.
• Technology Discussion: Xterra's technology is a pebble bed, small modular reactor, different than SMR, 80 megawatts, fully modular deployable.

▶️Senator King to Billy Bardin

• Senator King referenced Comanche Peak, the last nuclear power plant built in Texas, noting significant cost overruns in its construction due largely to federal regulations causing frequent design changes.
• When Comanche Peak became operational, local electric bills reportedly increased significantly.
• The conversation shifted to a new project involving a set of four 80-megawatt reactors, totaling 320 megawatts.
• The cost of these new reactors is still being validated internally and has not yet been disclosed to the board of directors or made public.
• Discussion highlighted economies of scale, suggesting costs could decrease as more units are produced.
• Concerns on the unavailability of project cost.

▶️Senator King to Griffin Perry

• Discussion on the potential for nuclear energy in Texas and the challenges associated with it.
• Concern about the long timeframe (minimum of ten years) and high cost of nuclear energy projects.
• Natural gas is currently abundant and a quicker, cheaper option for building power plants.
• Debate over state control over natural gas versus federal control over nuclear energy via the NRC.
• Importance of energy diversity and having a mix of natural gas, wind, solar, and nuclear for emergencies.
• Global competition and rising costs for natural gas turbine equipment create challenges.
• Nuclear energy is seen as a necessary part of the energy mix for future stability and competitiveness.
• Concerns about natural gas price volatility and the long-term cost-effectiveness of nuclear energy.
• Billy Bardin states that nuclear facilities provide long-term output with low variable costs, potentially offsetting initial high expenses.
• Questions raised about the effectiveness of proposed legislation and where Texas should focus its energy investment.
• Reference to Tennessee's legislative efforts in nuclear energy.
• Mention of only one nuclear facility built in the U.S. in the past 25 years.

▶️Senator Menendez to Griffin Perry

• Discussion with Griffin Perry who represents Fermi America.
• Clarification that Fermi America is a company, not a trade association.
• Fermi America is a small, nascent company partnered with major institutions.
• The company is developing a project near Amarillo, Texas.
• The project includes nuclear, gas, and solar power components.
• There will be co-location with data centers.
• A significant portion of the project's energy output will supply the grid.

▶️Senator Menendez to Billy Bardin

• Senator Menendez inquired about the potential application for grants if a bill passes in its current form.
• Billy Bardin confirmed their companies would apply for grants aimed at shareholder wealth maximization.
• Concern was raised about taxpayers' representation and stewardship of their dollars.
• Discussion on how providing grants would influence project timelines or development speed.
• Billy Bardin noted that project timelines are determined by long-lead equipment items, not the grant program.
• Development of four plants, up to 360 megawatts, is estimated to cost in the billions of dollars.
• $200 million is seen as beneficial for investors but not significantly impactful on capital costs.
• Concerns about nuclear waste management were discussed, particularly regarding storage of waste on-site.
• There was no mention of provisions in the bill addressing nuclear waste management.
• Appreciation was expressed for the panel's testimony and responses.

▶️Senator Johnson to Griffin Perry

• Discussion on the potential benefits and reservations about small modular nuclear programs.
• Emphasis on support from the federal government for nuclear energy initiatives.
• Argument made for Texas to invest in nuclear energy as it would bring benefits globally and particularly to the United States.
• Intention to build a nuclear plant in Texas, with a focus on state-specific incentives to attract business.
• Mention of existing competition among states for nuclear energy projects.
• Currently, there are five active permits in the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, with only one in Texas, signaling a chance for Texas to take the lead by showing support.
• Support from the state could potentially attract more nuclear energy projects and create jobs, benefiting Texas' economy.

▶️Senator Johnson to Adrian Shelley

• Discussion on the move of workforce to Texas and training young people for the industry.
• Concerns raised about training and reconfiguring education at taxpayer expense without guarantee of future industry success.
• Large-scale investment highlighted: $200 million grant and additional costs for supply chain, permitting, workforce education, and construction.
• Concerns expressed about profits going to private companies while taxpayers subsidize risk.
• Cost to build projects varies $2 to $8 billion; examples given by Adrian Shelley of canceled projects with high projected costs per megawatt.
• Comparison with other current strategies shows proposed projects could be 10 to 20 times more expensive.
• Caution advised on investing big state money when market-driven solutions appear to be effective.
• Recognition that current market direction may not justify investment in the proposed scale.
• Acknowledgement of nuclear energy's potential benefits and importance of domestic supply chain development.
• Discussion on transferable skills gained within the industry.

▶️Senator Nichols to Billy Bardin

• Mention of Dow's involvement in nuclear power research and development as a means to diversify energy mix.
• Clarification that Dow has not changed its primary mission but is addressing power supply issues.
• Dow's interest in nuclear power is intentional and deliberate, not mission creep.
• Concerns about the federal government's slow decision-making process regarding nuclear energy permits.
• Skepticism about creating a new state department focused on nuclear research and development due to potential federal inaction.
• Discussion on workforce training and job availability, highlighting the mismatch between training initiatives and current job market needs.
• Suggestion to save money instead of creating new departments and spend on real investments once federal approvals are clear.

▶️Senator Schwertner to Billy Bardin

• Discussion about the Dow project with X-energy and the involvement of a commercial director for North America who testified in the past.
• The natural gas generation on-site at Dow has a remaining life cycle of about ten years, which aligns with the X-energy project.
• Final decision on proceeding with X-energy is not yet made and depends on the support from the state and federal government permits.
• A final investment decision is expected to be made in the coming years.
• Construction permits application is anticipated to be approved in approximately thirty months.
• The timeline for replacing assets at Seadrift is planned for the early 2030s.
• The project's continuation is dependent on federal permits.

▶️Senator Menendez to Panel 1 Group

• Support for establishing a specific office within the governor's office to improve coordination on permitting timelines.
• Concerns about decommissioning and safety to ensure environmental protection for Texans.
• Apprehension about the $200,000,000 in grants without clarity on returns, preferring a loan program instead.
• Senator Schwertner mentioned a $750,000,000 supplemental being discussed between the house and the senate for nuclear energy, reflecting debates on state taxpayer investment in somewhat novel technology.
• Confirmation of the industry's proven capacity but uncertainty regarding timelines and returns.

Panel 2

▶️John Umfress

• John Umfress testifies on behalf of himself, opposing HB14.
• Main opposition due to use of tax dollars for subsidies to private investments in advanced nuclear reactors.
• Concerns over $750 million appropriation with potential increase to $2 billion.
• Funds could be used for other state needs, potentially benefiting Texans more.
• HB14 allows grants to be large enough to fund projects receiving more than the currently earmarked amount.
• Projects under HB14 may not be required to connect to the grid.
• Advanced nuclear reactors are not cost-competitive compared to other generation options (combined cycle natural gas, solar PV, onshore wind, solar PV battery hybrid, and geothermal).
• Emphasis on waiting for advanced reactor technology to mature and costs to stabilize.
• Prefer deployment of more affordable and mature generation technologies in the meantime.

▶️Susybelle Gosslee

• Public opposition to HB14 from Susybelle Gosslee.
• Concern about the use of public money for costly nuclear projects with minimal return.
• Nuclear reactors have long timelines of 5-10 years before becoming operational, delaying electricity production.
• Historical evidence shows nuclear projects frequently exceed budget and face delays or cancellation.
• Criticism of bill converting loans for dispatchable energy into grants, potentially amounting to over $2 billion.
• Call for amendments to focus on loans instead of grants, ensuring benefits for the grid and Texans, not private firms.
• Emphasis on allocating funds to more affordable and rapidly deployable energy technologies.
• Argument that the nuclear industry should rely on private investment instead of public funding.

▶️Carolyn Croome, Texas Nuclear Watchdogs

• Carolyn Croome opposes HB14, citing it as a taxpayer-funded handout to the nuclear industry.
• Arguing the nuclear industry has a history of not producing safe, cost-effective, and timely products.
• Mentions Comanche Peak and South Texas Project's cost overruns and delays, affecting consumers.
• Calls for nuclear power to compete in the open energy market without additional state subsidies.
• Nuclear power is deemed the most expensive energy source in the U.S. even with federal subsidies.
• References a report questioning the financial viability of small modular reactors (SMRs).
• Quotes John Ketchum of NextEra Energy expressing skepticism on the cost and risks of SMRs.
• Emphasizes the need for Texas to focus on proven, affordable energy sources that can be implemented quickly.
• Urges a vote against HB14.

▶️Dr. Joe Elabd, TAMU

• Dr. Joe Elabd, Vice Chancellor for Research for the TAMU System, provided testimony on HB14 regarding energy technology advancement in Texas.
• The A&M System is utilizing its RELLIS campus for applied research and innovation to test advanced technologies.
• A feasibility study commissioned by the system determined the RELLIS campus is suitable for electricity generation by small modular nuclear reactors.
• In spring and late summer of 2024, the A&M System issued requests for information and proposals to site advanced nuclear reactors, receiving positive responses.
• On November 7, a notice of intent to pursue an early site permit with the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission was submitted.
• After evaluation, four companies were selected to site at the RELLIS campus: Kairos Power, Natura Resources, Terrestrial Energy, and Aalo Atomics.
• The A&M System aims to partner in applied research, innovation, workforce development, and talent provision within the advanced nuclear sector.

▶️Senator Menéndez to Dr. Joe Elabd

• Dr. Joe Elabd represents Texas A&M.
• Natura Resources responded to the RFI and has received a permit from the NRC, located in Abilene, Texas.
• There is a concern about ensuring clean and cost-effective energy solutions moving forward.
• Use of small modular nuclear reactors as a high heat source for desalination has been proposed.
• No further questions were raised by the members.

Panel 3

▶️John Portillo, Paragon Energy Solutions

• John Portillo is the Vice President of Global New Nuclear for Paragon Energy Solutions.
• Expressed support for HB14, emphasizing Texas's potential to lead in new nuclear plant development.
• Highlighted the historic support from the public, private, and federal government for nuclear industry growth.
• Stressed the importance of state leadership and financial support to become a leader in nuclear manufacturing and grid stability.
• Mentioned that nuclear development will attract data centers, materials science & chemical manufacturing facilities, and semiconductor factories to Texas.
• Predicted significant economic and energy security benefits for Texas with nuclear development.
• Paragon Energy, based in Fort Worth, anticipates creating over 200 high-paying jobs in the next two to three years due to nuclear growth.
• Urged the committee to support HB14 for the benefit of Texas.

▶️David Patterson, Bridge to Nuclear

• David Patterson, CEO of Bridge to Nuclear, testifies on HB14.
• Bridge to Nuclear proposes legislation to support the development of an Advanced Nuclear and Innovative Energy Technologies Office.
• Urges legislation to issue reimbursement funds for developing a co-located dispatchable generation facility and an advanced nuclear reactor.
• Texas taxpayers support nuclear power but demand financial caps due to a history of cost and timeline overruns in nuclear projects.
• The proposed project features a unified approach with two parallel tracks: a 300 MW natural gas power plant and an advanced nuclear reactor.
• Profits from the natural gas plant would finance the nuclear reactor construction.
• Benefits include near-term dispatchable generation, clear construction timeline for the nuclear project, capped state financial commitment, and shifting financial risks from public to private.
• The project aims to bring 300 MW of dispatchable generation online in 2-3 years.
• Nuclear companies benefit through blended power purchase agreements and securing contracts for immediate power needs transitioning from natural gas to nuclear.
• Large-scale data centers require high reliability, which the project aims to address by providing consistent power.
• Natural gas is proposed as a practical bridge to nuclear energy.

▶️Elaina Ball, CPS Energy

• Elaina Ball, Chief Strategy Officer for CPS Energy, supports HB14.
• Emphasized the importance of nuclear energy for Texas.
• CPS Energy is one of the original owners of the South Texas Project (STP) in Bay City and is ready to utilize new nuclear technologies.
• The STP site has capabilities for hosting additional reactors, including light water reactors and small modular reactors (SMRs).
• Elaina Ball believes SMRs represent the future of nuclear energy.
• CPS Energy is exploring partnerships, such as with Joint Base San Antonio, to use SMRs for critical military operations.
• For advanced nuclear technologies to be viable, they need to demonstrate reliability, scalability, and operational efficiency to reduce costs.
• HB14 is seen as instrumental in decreasing early development, siting, and construction costs, and it fosters workforce development and regulatory support for advanced nuclear reactors.
• HB14 aims to reduce costs, encourage investment, and initiate a nuclear renaissance in Texas.
• Elaina Ball reiterated her availability for questions and expressed appreciation to the committee.

▶️Dale Beal

• Dale Beal expressed opposition to the proposal under discussion.
• Beal is a Texan and supporter of clean and affordable energy.
• He mentioned an article from the Austin American Statesman with the ERCOT president's concerns about legislative roadblocks.
• There is a need for 71% more energy production by 2030.
• Existing industry proposals fail to meet this energy production goal.
• Wind and solar energy, with battery backup, can be operational in under a year and provide dispatchable energy.
• Beal highlighted the significant cost of current programs, funded by taxpayers.
• He urged for the defeat of the proposal until it undergoes substantial improvements.

▶️Senator Johnson to David Patterson

• Commendation on the model of using initial profits from a natural gas plant to finance a nuclear plant.
• State's grant money will initially go towards the gas plant, not the nuclear plant.
• The state will not own interest in the gas plant but supports conversion of profits to seed money for the nuclear plant.
• Proposed agreement ensures gas plant profits will be used for nuclear plant financing.
• Profits from the gas plant are not sufficient to fully fund the nuclear project but serve as a financial start.
• Concerns raised about the possibility of not attracting further investment, risking nuclear plant construction.
• Application to include agreements allowing project reassignment or repayment of grant if nuclear plant isn't built.
• Dale Beal noted supply chain delays for natural gas turbines, suggesting an 18-month timeline for a solar plant with battery backup.

Panel 4

▶️Matt Loszak, Aalo Atomics

• Matt Loszak, cofounder and CEO of Aalo Atomics, introduced himself and shared a personal story about growing up in Ontario where nuclear power helped alleviate his asthma.
• Loszak has a background in software startups with a significant exit and relocated to Texas to focus on Aalo Atomics.
• Aalo Atomics is developing small modular nuclear reactors aimed at powering AI data centers.
• Loszak highlighted the potential economic growth from investments in nuclear power and expressed support for HB14.
• He compared the potential of nuclear power to the oil and gas industry, noting nuclear's long-term advantages and significant future opportunities.
• Loszak cited a unique opportunity in the next five years where data center developers have a high demand for small nuclear reactors to support large-scale data centers.
• He emphasized the importance of establishing the necessary infrastructure to support this demand and solidify the grid at ERCOT.

▶️Glenn Hamer, TAB

• Glenn Hamer, president and CEO of the Texas Association of Business, expressed strong support for HB14.
• HB14 is considered a game-changing investment in nuclear power and the future of Texas's economy.
• The emphasis is on ensuring reliable, affordable, and abundant power for Texas businesses to compete and grow.
• The initiative aims to secure Texas's position as the global energy capital.
• The support aligns with efforts for American energy dominance, as seen in the Trump administration's strategies.
• Governor Abbott's commitment to making Texas a leader in nuclear energy was highlighted.
• There's a need for reliable, affordable, and clean nuclear energy to maintain leadership in data centers and AI.
• The bill fits into Texas's economic development plans, supporting growth in data centers and AI with significant investments already planned.
• Texas continues to experience rapid population growth, adding around 1,500 new residents daily.
• Hamer thanked the chairman for his leadership in advancing HB14.

▶️Paige Murphy-Young

• Paige Murphy-Young spoke as an individual and member of Texas nuclear watchdogs.
• HB14 aligns with goals of the Texas advanced nuclear reactor working group, submitted to the governor.
• Concerns exist over small modular reactor technology, questioning its simplicity and safety compared to conventional reactors.
• References studies from Stanford and the DOE that indicate small modular reactors produce comparable nuclear waste to conventional reactors.
• NuScale is the first modular reactor to receive design approval; other designs are still awaiting approval.
• No finalized rules by NRC for permit issuance for small modular reactor facilities.
• HB14 involves using taxpayer dollars to fund development of untested small modular reactor technology.
• Risks highlighted include human health and potential impacts on limited water resources.

▶️Cyrus Reed, Sierra Club

• Cyrus Reed, Lone Star chapter chair of the Sierra Club, opposes HB14.
• Reed's written testimony argues the bill is too expensive, risky, and slow.
• Mentions Comanche Peak took 16 years to become operational, far exceeding initial cost estimates.
• Reed proposes suggestions if the bill moves forward:
• Convert planned grants into loans.
• Ensure projects contribute to ERCOT's electricity supply.
• Advocate for relocating the nuclear energy office to the PUC for better oversight.
• Suggests that the Senate should confirm the nuclear officer.
• Propose adding safety and life cycle management standards, agreeing with Senator Menéndez.
• Sierra Club is not opposed to workforce development or collaborating with universities on the technology.
• Opposition to taxpayer subsidies, specifically for companies like Dow or associated with produced water.
• Emphasizes that while they are against the bill, they are offering constructive criticism.

Panel 5

▶️Stephen Beers

• Stephen Beers is speaking against a proposed bill.
• He compares the promotion of smaller nuclear reactors to repeating past ideas, suggesting a lack of innovation.
• Beers highlights the long history of nuclear energy's reliance on subsidies.
• He implies that if natural gas faces challenges, other industries like Dow Chemical will also be affected due to their reliance on natural gas.
• Beers argues for alternative energy solutions, such as methane capture and improving the efficiency of gas-powered units.
• He does not support the giveaway program being proposed, viewing it as not in the public interest.

▶️Drew DeWalt, General Matter

• Drew DeWalt supports HB14, emphasizing the importance of the US developing its nuclear energy capabilities.
• Current global nuclear energy supply chains are dominated by Russia and China.
• The US government is investing in nuclear reactors and the supply chain, including uranium enrichment.
• DeWalt advocates for Texas to become a leader in the nuclear energy sector.
• Mentioned support for a milestone-based grant with 50% matching funds and clawback provisions if projects are not completed.
• There were no questions from members and public testimony was closed.
• Senator Schwertner noted that decisions regarding nuclear incentives are imminent.
• The bill remains pending, subject to the call of the chair.

▶️4 - HB1584 Hull | et al. SP: Schwertner

• Chair introduced HB1584, explained by Senate sponsor Senator Schwertner.
• HB1584 responds to communication failures during Hurricane Beryl.
• Issues included facilities not identified for priority power restoration.
• Example: Houston fire stations on backup power for days due to lack of prioritization.
• HB1584 requires utilities to maintain and update a list of priority power facilities.
• The list includes hospitals, police stations, fire stations, and critical infrastructure.
• Utilities to develop online mechanisms for facilities to seek priority designation.
• Utilities to coordinate with the Texas Division of Emergency Management during emergencies.
• Aim to improve communication and power restoration efforts during emergencies.
• No registered witnesses to testify; public testimony closed.
• Bill remains pending, subject to Chair's call.

▶️5 - HB1606 Metcalf | et al. SP: Zaffirini

• The House chair introduced HB1606 and acknowledged Senate sponsor Dean Zaffirini.
• HB1606 is related to notifying retail electric customers about vegetation management procedures near transmission or distribution lines.
• The objective is to have retail electric providers inform customers through utility bills about how to request vegetation management.
• The purpose of the bill is to reduce administrative burden and ensure timely delivery of information.
• No members had questions for the sponsor.
• Opened for public testimony; no one registered to testify.
• Closed public testimony and stated the bill will remain pending.